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jez2
06 Jun 2009, 07:09 PM
Copied from the speed section with Nosim's permission. It is written specifically for speed servers, but most of what is said would apply to normal servers too, and so I thought would be worth replicating here.

So here's Nosim's advice on how to get maximum damage out your (or your alliance's) hammers.

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Combat Sims

Please before anything do a combat sim of your army and expected defence and see how much damage you will do.

Use http://kirilloid.ru/travian/warsim.php

Organisation

Its best to be organised by an alliance leader or someone in charge of offensive hitting. Its always best to attack as a unit. Try to get organised and maintain good communication.

Raiding the WW

Raiding is a great way to get the defence numbers of an opponent, a good 10k mace raid would have at least 1 macemen come home so that the defence numbers are revealed.

Rule 1: DO NOT hit the WW

Lets say a small/average WW army with a 20% off hero and 10%+ plus attack turned on with everything at level 20 in the blacksmith, vs an average of 7 million defence (average for this round anyway) with a level 20 wall.

Here is a combat sim report for targeting the WW when its on level 70:
http://i452.photobucket.com/albums/qq248/trumpetmanjez/L70WWhit.png

You managed to lower the WW from 70 to 67 level. The total build time to repair would be 7:52:30 (hours:mins:secs)

Lets say we target 2 level Great Warehouses, they probably wont be level 20 but for an example I have done a combat sim vs level 20 Great Warehouses.
http://i452.photobucket.com/albums/qq248/trumpetmanjez/2xGWhit.png

The total build time lost from that combat sim report is 35:27:40

WW- 7:52:30
GW- 35:27:40

It don't take a genius to work out that targeting the Great Warehouse is far more effective. The reason why is buildings get stronger when it goes up in levels.

The only time you should hit a WW is when you know you will do more damage then hitting other buildings, such as when you have a monster army or when your hitting a lowly defended WW. I recommend doing a combat sim.

Hitting 1 thing or 2?
http://i452.photobucket.com/albums/qq248/trumpetmanjez/1xGWhit.png

That is the same army targeting 1 thing. It may look good that it destroyed it completely but you have to think about the build time. 28:05:00 it will take to repair, that is much less then hitting 2 things. Remember higher levels take longer to build.

Main Building

Main buildings repair a lot faster then the Great Warehouses. The thing is you know 100% that they will have a main building and it will be on level 20.

Ram army's

Walls are very hard to take down, and usually unless its a Roman you will need a few ram armys to take a WW wall down to 0.

Here is a Teuton log:
http://i452.photobucket.com/albums/qq248/trumpetmanjez/Ramsvsteutwall.png

Gaul:
http://i452.photobucket.com/albums/qq248/trumpetmanjez/Ramsvsgaulwall.png

Roman:
http://i452.photobucket.com/albums/qq248/trumpetmanjez/Ramsvsromanwall.png

The best thing to do is to use them with multiple catapult army's. Remember to time the ram army before the other army's. Last round LEG hit me with there ram army in-between there attacks, so some army's wasn't as effective. It is really not cool.

When should I hit?

Remember the build time for things like Great Warehouses and Main Buildings is the same at any stage of end game. The thing that does change is defence, defence rises fast when everyone is trying to produce lots of it for the WW.

However using all your army's early will mean you have nothing left later on, and being to far in front will make you a target. Alliances sometimes will want to get revenge.

What I recommend is sending the smaller ones 1st, and then the larger ones after level 70/80 and the massive 16k+ cata ones after 90.

Always keep a running record of how the WW village is growing. You know what the population from fields is, you know how much population an X level WW is, so you can accurately judge how much infrastructure they have. Not much point in destroying 6 GWs if they are all level 1.

Hitting a few seconds after a natar attack could be effective as natars really do hurt defence.

Do not time your hammer so it hits them after level 98, unless your targeting the WW itself which isn't good. They would have queued level 100 so wont be needing there storage anymore. Plus hitting the main building wont effect the build times.

What should I target?

Here is the build time for 1-20

Great Warehouse: 1 04:05:00
Great Granary: 22:45:30
Main Building: 12:12:10
Normal Warehouse: 9:27:00
Wall (rams): 9:27:00 (for all tribes)
Normal Granary: 8:23:10

Great Warehouses are the best to hit. Remember some WWs may build normal warehouses instead of the great ones.

Tactical Strikes

Sometimes its good to think about a plan.

One example would be, to destroy all Great Granarys/Granarys and then they have to send the defence home in order to build again since 800 wheat would last 0.2 seconds in a WW. If they send defence home even for a little while it leaves there WW open for an attack. Hitting wheat fields and you could crop lock a WW. Also since they will be only level 6 smaller army's can destroy them.

Could you imagine hitting a lowly defended WW building at level 80. Also defence will starve at an alarming rate.

Hitting the right WW's

Make sure the one you are hitting is a real WW, send a cata fake targeting stable/barracks and stuff and see what it says.

Also remember in a 3-4 way race you have more then 1 opponent, if you completely take out one of them that is one less person the others need to hit.

Hope it helps. There probably will be mistakes.

Stink
07 Jun 2009, 06:55 AM
I likey!

Avi
08 Jun 2009, 12:32 PM
Could you print-screen the pictures instead of linking to Kirilloid? Most of those reports will expire over time and the guide would become useless if we can't replace them or remember what they had in them.

Also I think it's very simple to be called an Advanced Guide ? It would be nice to have some depiction of real WWK armies hitting defenses on old servers, and Nosim's advice being put into practice. Obviously this would be different for Speed / Normal, but that's what helps a guide become official - just a bit more time put into it so it can cater to everybody. Or if it's specifically for Speed, don't try to generalize it if a player on a Normal server won't be able to relate to it.

jez2
08 Jun 2009, 04:53 PM
Good points, and noted. I'll get some screencaps in soon.

I wasn't sure about the tag either, but going on these guidelines:


[Intermediate]: These kind of players now know how travian works, technically, but they haven't explored every bit yet. They may not yet have used catapults, conquered, etc.
[Advanced]: These players know all aspects of travian, may have played a full server before and are looking for the tricks, which buildings/fields to build at the launch of the server to grow the fastest, what sort of rules should alliances have & how do you strategically win a war without a lot of damage to your account?

It seemed to fit better with advanced. I can't really imagine a player with a WWK at their disposal not having used catapults before! Also since this was geared towards maximising damage rather than the mechanics of it I thought it warranted the "advanced" tag.

If the general consensus is that [intermediate] would be more suitable, then I'd be fine with that too.

Tullia
20 Jul 2009, 11:26 PM
I think the layout needs a little work to differentiate the different heading levels a little more. :)

Avi
20 Jul 2009, 11:31 PM
It would be nice to see the other half of those reports as well, so we can determine what is causing the 120 000 axe to go splat. You've noted an average 7 million defense, but what that is made up of and scout reports from WWs are very important. For example if your enemy has a cav-heavy defense you might choose to send a member's army which is inf heavy.

Together, Tullia and I will have a tonne of end game WWK speed reports if needed. As far as visuals go, it is a nice comparative.

nosim
25 Jul 2009, 08:13 PM
7 million is small defence, above 19million is rather large but there's usually at least one WW with that much, around 15 million is considered normal by many WW builders I know but I would say 13 million is average.

For normal servers I have no idea, but I have seen reports that make me guess the average defence would be around 3 million.

This guide wasn't intended to be here, but if I get the time I will write a larger more detailed one soon.

Avi
26 Jul 2009, 01:53 PM
For normal servers I have no idea, but I have seen reports that make me guess the average defence would be around 3 million.
Average for winning WWs to successfully bounce armies is around 6-7 million, all the others which get smashed have around 3-4 million.